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This may just be my personal taste, but I don't think the "gazoo" aliens for proposed & incubating projects look terribly professional. Here are my reasons: a) While I'm a huge fan of cartoons, I don't see short, pointy-headed aliens as being something that suggests credibility and professionalism. (Maybe I've seen too many Invader Zim episodes.) b) The images (http://www.eclipse.org/projects/gazoo.php) are very large and surprisingly distracting when placed on a website. I understand that the point is to draw attention to the fact that the project hasn't gone through a Release Review yet, but doesn't the code being versioned < 1.0 say the same thing? The graphic representation of this fact need not be so ostentatious. c) All the other Phoenix graphics on the Eclipse site are small, iconic, and surrounded by white. This is both subtle and clean. * http://www.eclipse.org/ * http://www.eclipse.org/resources/ "Gazoo", on the other hand, is large, graphic, and surrounded by purple. This doesn't mesh very well with predominantly white Phoenix pages with purple/grey accents. d) Should you need more than one "gazoo" per page (projects with components), the page becomes very busy, very fast. For example: http://www.eclipse.org/emft/ So, with that in mind, I'd like to propose a logo contest to design replacement images, as done for Modeling (bug 154906) and WTP (bug 122593).
Created attachment 59616 [details] current and possible alternative (more iconic) variants As I'm playing with the EMFT site right now, the example cited won't necessarily exist later, so here's a couple screen shots showing what's there now and and idea for what it could become. This still uses the existing gazoo, but presents two variants for home and downloads pages.
(In reply to comment #0) > b) The images ... are very large and > surprisingly distracting when placed on a website. Yes, and they will continue to be so even after we get a more acceptable image. You're correct that the point is to draw attention to the incubation stage. The membership and the Board have requested this, especially as Incubation Phase now allows a lighter-weight IP process. > d) Should you need more than one "gazoo" per page (projects with components), You don't need more than one image per page - the phases only apply to projects, never to components. Components do not incubate separately from projects: the Board and the community were very clear about that in the last revisions to the Development Process. > So, with that in mind, I'd like to propose a logo contest > to design replacement > images, as done for Modeling (bug 154906) and WTP (bug 122593). Excellent! Here's my suggestion as an attachment.
Created attachment 59758 [details] Incubation Eclipse logo (egg) This could either go in the right column, replacing gazoo, or it could go in the top header, replacing the existing top-left Eclipse logo.
*** Bug 123254 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***
good call, I tried to this much earlier but to my dismay, the foundation wasn't as responsive ;) It was probably my incoherent bug description ;) It should be done similar in spirit to the Modeling contest, maybe winner gets a t-shirt?
I like the egg concept, but if hadn't read this bug report, it would not have been clear to me that Bjorn's suggested logo depicts a cracked egg. After all, there are no blue eggs. There is also no evidence of the presence of eggs on Jupiter, which seems to be the theme for everything we do in Eclipse for some reason. To me, it looks like the logo is depicting a schism in the Eclipse community. I suggest the new logo act as a 'uniter, not a divider', so to speak ;)
Created attachment 59760 [details] Incubation logo (egg) v2 Wassim, you're a hard one to please - how about an classically colored egg with plug-ins inside? (And, yes, there are blue eggs at Easter :-)
(In reply to comment #7) > Created an attachment (id=59760) [details] > Incubation logo (egg) v2 Seems a bit busy, but not nearly as busy as the idea that Christian and I were talking about on Friday. It started with the idea of a fetus in a lavalamp. (Why a lavalamp? Same era as Gazoo!) It ended up somehow orienting the fetus into a pose like that from Ghostbusters II poster (http://www.allposters.com/-sp/Ghostbusters-II-Posters_i939304_.htm) with the two-fingered "V" symbol, not for "2" in this case, but for "validation." I can see it in my head, but my photoshop/gimp skills aren't up to the challenge. I suppose the lavalamp's goo blobs could form themselves into plugin motifs and other eclipse'y shapes, since in the proposal/validation phases, not everything's solidified and is still somewhat in flux... On further reflection, all this could be done as shapes in the atmosphere of a planet (Jupiter, of course!), rather than the lavalamp. Or hell, you could stick with the planetary motif and current logo (http://www.eclipse.org/eclipse.org-common/themes/Phoenix/images/header_logo.gif), and simply differentiate the three states with one, two, or three rings around the eclipsed planet. Or apple-core-like bites (where of course 2 bites = proposal / least amount of planet, 1 = validation / almost whole, and 0 = post release review / full planet).
No, please don't break Eclipse.. ;)
I'd like to cloud the issue with some facts. :-) Firstly, I wanted to dispel the myth that are no blue eggs. I'm sure most of us have seen a robin's egg, which is quite blue, and a quick google for "blue eggs" will reveal that Araucana Chickens have blue eggs. So while there may be no such thing as a blue pony, there are in fact blue eggs. Secondly, doesn't a cracked egg kind of represent the end of incubation? After all, once the egg cracks open, the chick is either hatched or croaked and in either case is certainly no longer incubating. That being said, I rather like both Bjorn's logos.
Wassim, you also forget the obvious Blue Bird, whose eggs are typically blue: http://www.flickr.com/photos/lucycat/119807654/in/set-72057594093527496/
Unless one can provide evidence to a blue egg on Jupiter, this metaphor would be inconsistent with the rest of Eclipse :) On a serious note, I am concerned about showing a crack on something blue in the logo just because, as I said in comment 6, it symoblizes a schism in Eclipse.
I agree with the schism idea. We should look at possibly just having a normal Eclipse logo that looks like a waning gibbous (http://www.carpecaelum.com/wangbbs.htm) with some reference to incubation on the logo? Adding Gen on CC from the famous Modeling project logo contest (https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=154906) to see if there is any input from Gen (if the time is available). Gen did such a great job for the modeling project!!!
Chris, a waning moon just wouldn't do! This is an incubation, so a new moon or waxing moon makes more sense ;) (personally, I don't see the egg logo as schismatic, but I won't offer any other suggestions due to my utter lack of artistic skill)
/me slaps himself
Created attachment 61349 [details] An incubation page using gazoo (as is today)
Created attachment 61350 [details] An incubation page using hatching egg (proposed)
It's been a month and we've had a few opinions, but not the overwhelming comments that I was led to believe we might have. I posted my proposed new look in two gifs (old/today and new/proposed). Comments?
(In reply to comment #18) > It's been a month and we've had a few opinions, but not the overwhelming > comments that I was led to believe we might have. I posted my proposed new look > in two gifs (old/today and new/proposed). Comments? I recall some discussion about this at EclipseCON, and the consensus from those I spoke with was that the new logo is much better than the previous. I have two questions, however: 1. Was this logo to go in the top-right corner as a replacement for the standard one (ie., this would be added to Phoenix), or just to continue in the right side boxes? 2. Do you have a similar logo idea for proposed projects? Or are we going to use the same logo for both proposed and incubating?
Created attachment 61407 [details] An incubation page using hatching egg (proposed top-left)
(In reply to comment #19) > I recall some discussion about this at EclipseCON, and the > consensus from those I spoke with was that the new logo is > much better than the previous. I recall similar discussion, but I had hoped that we could have some more permanent record, i.e., comments on this bug. > 1. Was this logo to go in the top-right corner as a replacement for the > standard one (ie., this would be added to Phoenix), or just to continue in the > right side boxes? I've posted another attachment showing how that would look. I'm less in favor of that because the incubation state is less visually obvious to the casual page reader. And I think that casual page reader is who the Board was trying to notify with this requirement. The experienced Eclipse project peruser will already know which projects are in incubation and which are not. > 2. Do you have a similar logo idea for proposed projects? Or are we going to > use the same logo for both proposed and incubating? I thought about a proposed projects logo, but then I figured that proposals (a) don't look like projects (they are simply one page on the website in a unique url location) and (b) already have a "Proposal" background watermark. So we probably don't need a proposal logo.
Created attachment 61415 [details] Gunnar's incubation logo attempt #1 Ok, here is my proposal. I know, not very creative. But I find this more appealing than a broken egg.
Created attachment 61416 [details] Gunnar's incubation logo attempt #2 different wording
(In reply to comment #22) > more appealing than a broken egg. A hatching egg - hatching, not broken :-)
(In reply to comment #24) > A hatching egg - hatching, not broken :-) Ah ok ... but I'm sorry, I don't really get this association from the proposals. Maybe we need something like .... http://www.bp.com/liveassets/bp_internet/norway/STAGING/brand_assets/technology/innovation_egg_hatching_light_180x144.jpg ;)
(In reply to comment #25) Yes, that's what I was going for, but my Photoshop skills are just not good enough. If enough people like that, we can hire a real artist to make us an nice Eclipse-glowing-hatching-egg picture.
(In reply to comment #25) > (In reply to comment #24) > > A hatching egg - hatching, not broken :-) http://www.bp.com/liveassets/bp_internet/norway/STAGING/brand_assets/technology/innovation_egg_hatching_light_180x144.jpg +1 for something along these lines.
I've been following this discussion (sorry for not contributing anything yet,) but now I'd like to ask a question... I thought Nick originally raised this bug entry for "proposed" AND "incubating" images. A lot has been discussed regarding incubating project, but what about proposed projects? Don't they need a brand new "proposed" image?
(In reply to comment #21 and comment #28) > I thought about a proposed projects logo, but then I figured that proposals > don't look like projects and already have a "Proposal" background watermark. Considering the only place I've seen the "proposal" logo is on the gazoo page itself (http://www.eclipse.org/projects/gazoo.php), not on the http://www.eclipse.org/proposals/ or any of its linked children... I have to agree, we only need an incubation/validation phase logo. +1
+1 for the eclipse egg theme. I like the idea. The only downside is that it can be a bit subtle. If perhaps a mixture of the egg and Gunnar's direction and have Eclipse incubator overlaying the egg (with "incubator" in smaller font) or some such.
Created attachment 61569 [details] Egg + eclipse Nick, forgive me for asking silly question (about proposal phase). I have to admit I wasn't reading carefully... Attached file is something I imagined from Jeff's comment (#30).
(In reply to comment #31) > Created an attachment (id=61569) [details] > Egg + eclipse I like it. So if the egg could now get the hatching touch like the URL I posted in comment 25 that would be really awesome!
(In reply to comment #32) > > Egg + eclipse > I like it. So if the egg could now get the hatching touch like the URL I posted > in comment 25 that would be really awesome! +1 If you find yourself with too much time on your hands, you could do up a set of these in different pastel colours and we could put them up around the site from April 1 to April 8 for some sort of egg hunt... perhaps a contest to encourage the community to learn about these incubating projects, and win a prize in the process...?
(In reply to comment #32) Nice but, um, isn't a bit large? The challenge in this kind of logo/icon design to create something that's both representative and small. (Not saying that my hatching egg does that, but at least it's small.) I'm not sure where on the eclipse.org pages I would put that large image - any ideas? And I'm not sure how to shrink it to retain your intent (just scaling to 1/5th size would make the text and the eclipse logo too small)(making the egg smaller would shrink it behind the logo) (...?)
(In reply to comment #34) > (In reply to comment #32) > Nice but, um, isn't a bit large? The challenge in this kind of logo/icon design > to create something that's both representative and small. Good point... it would be nice to have both a logo and an icon version, similar to the Modeling Project's new logo and in-progress feature icon (bug 154906). In this way, projects which have incubating pieces can differentiate the components which are incubating / not incubating. My first hack at this (using gazoo) looks a little like this: http://www.eclipse.org/emft/projects/ (OCL, Query, Transaction and Validation exited incubation during Callisto, and thus don't have gazoo icons). This means we need something that scales down well to 32x32px - perhaps the icon doesn't need the text on it, just the cracked/glowing egg idea. Hell, we could even use that icon in features, if we wanted to really use this as in-Eclipse feature branding, not just as website demarcation. Thoughts?
Created attachment 61679 [details] Cool Cracking Egg I found this example on the web. I like it better than the "exploding egg".
My two cents...(this comment was meant to go with the "Cool Cracking Egg"" image) I like Bjorn's concept much more than the current incubation logo. That said, I think it needs some work so that it doesn't look like the "solar body" in the Eclipse logo is exploding. My artistic skills are pathetic at best, but I would do something with the cracking egg so that it was absolutely clear that it was an egg opening to give birth to a new idea/technology. See the attached (which I completely ripped off) which is a pretty good representation of what I'm trying to say. MikeT
Created attachment 61688 [details] 96x128 egg Bjorn, > isn't a bit large? Uh, yes, it is. Actually, that was my concern, too. Attached image is best I could do in relatively short time (to scale smaller), but I believe we need something better than this. (I created this one before reading Nick's comment#35, so, although it's smaller, this is not 32px by 32px icon style)
Created attachment 61693 [details] An incubation page using 96x128 egg (In reply to comment #38) Here's what the incubation page could look like with the nice 96x128 egg. I kind of like it.
Created attachment 61697 [details] A partial incubation page w/ 96x128 egg + mocked up icons on incubating components Another take.
As part of my rewrite of the "Guidelines to the Eclipse Development Process", I have incorporated the egg as a valid option. I also added enough weasely words that if we need to change to a better egg in the future, we can. http://www.eclipse.org/projects/dev_process/incubation-conforming.php I also sent a request to BP (British Petroleum) (who apparently owns the copyright to the glowing hatching egg we all like) to ask if they will grant us the rights to use a variation. Cross your fingers for a reply.
Created attachment 61926 [details] egg icons (32x32 & 16x16) Here are some icon sized (16x16 and 32x32) versions. I painted eclipse logo onto the egg, but since this is such a tiny image, a simple white egg w/o logo would probably be better...
Created attachment 61946 [details] A partial incubation page w/ 96x128 egg + transparent 16x16 egg icons Sweet. Now we're talking! It's not too subtle, is it? Should the main logo be tilted too, so that it's more square & also consistent w/ the icon?
(In reply to comment #43) > A partial incubation page w/ 96x128 egg + transparent 16x16 egg icons Nice but... the Eclipse Development Process does not provide for "partial incubation". Sorry - it's either all or nothing for a project. Of course, inside a project you can have your own project-specific distinction, but from the point of view of the Parallel IP and the 1.0 release numbering and all those EDP pluses-and-minuses, it's at the project level.
Just a question for clarification... If a non-incubating subproject has incubating components (that are not following the parallel IP process but rather have been fully reviewed and approved by Eclipse legal) should that subproject NOT include an incubating icon as an indicator or warning that the page will lead to incubating technology? I had assumed we'd still want to make sure it's clear that any particular component is incubating (i.e., has a version number < 1.0) but now I'm wondering if there is a rule that we shouldn't do that...
(In reply to comment #45) > Just a question for clarification... There is no rule against that - in fact, I think it's a good idea. I was just trying to explain that "non-incubating project = no parallel ip". In fact, I like the component annotation - I'll add that as a best practice (not a requirement) in the dev process guidelines.
Created attachment 62957 [details] Variations Here's an image with 8 variations of the egg in comment #38. Let's number these as 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 Although I am personally against the idea of hatching egg, I've included 4 versions with cartoon-like crack as well (2,4,6 and 8). I've added lens flare, drop shadow and glowing effect, but simple one with plain white background, 5, looks best to me.
(In reply to comment #47) I like number 8.
(In reply to comment #47) > 1 2 3 4 > 5 6 7 8 +1 for #5. The crack somehow reminds me of Peanuts' Charlie Brown's shirt, or perhaps Butters from South Park. Too cartoony, at any rate.
+1 for #8
Created attachment 63268 [details] Variations2 Before this contest (or bug) is closed... I'd like to add 4 more hatching version, A-D. 1 2 3 4 A B 5 6 7 8 C D I still like 5 best though.
(In reply to comment #51) > 1 2 3 4 A B > 5 6 7 8 C D > I still like 5 best though. Never having been a huge fan of Ye Olde Lense Flare, I still prefer #5, where the flare is the least obvious. I'm worried that cracking the egg will imply something about the projects being broken, damaged, substandard, etc. When you think 'cracked egg', what's the first thought that comes to mind? To me, an egg implies the incubation state, cracked or not. Cracking it adds another layer which - and again, maybe it's just me - connotes something at worst negative and at best provides no more state information than the uncracked egg. +1 for #5. +2 if there was no lens flare. ;-)
#5, +1
Created attachment 63360 [details] #5 with minor fix (In reply to comment #52) > +1 for #5. +2 if there was no lens flare. ;-) This may not be fair for the others, but modified #5 as you said.
I am not sure if a winner has been chosen yet, but the logo that is currently on the Eclipse Project Incubator is very nice: http://www.eclipse.org/eclipse/incubator/ Incidentally, when I was in high school, I was one of those annoying students in English class who saw "symbolism" in everything. So when I saw the crack in the blue egg in the earlier suggested logos, it was second nature to me to immediately yell "Schism!"
That egg is one of the ones from an attachment here. I think Bjorn identified it as a viable alternative and put it on the incubator compliance page. Ultimately the wording is such that we can change the icon as we refine the graphic.
Given two weeks have gone by w/o comments in this bug, can we reduce the list of options to the top three candidates and collect votes? I'd like to post the new icons/logos soon, but we need to agree on the winning designs first (or there'll be a schism!). Gen or Bjorn, can you go through the comments and pull out your top three designs or the designs w/ the most votes, and reattach them as a ballot-like image, so we can vote for options "A", "B", or "C"?
Created attachment 65779 [details] 3 eggs (In reply to comment #52) I believe these are the ones that got most votes. Labeled A, B and C from left to right. I assumed Bjorn's request to BP (comment #41) timed out, and this one http://www.bp.com/liveassets/bp_internet/norway/STAGING/brand_assets/technology/innovation_egg_hatching_light_180x144.jpg cannot be used. IF BP decided to let us to use it, it's certainly a great candidate, and I'll have to add candidate 'D' to the attached image. Did you get any reply, Bjorn? Image C is might look new, but actually the one on this page http://www.eclipse.org/eclipse/incubator/ but using white background. I thought all images should have the same background instead of only C having purple color. So now the differences between A and C might be subtle, but C does not have any lens flare effect.
(In reply to comment #58) > I assumed Bjorn's request to BP (comment #41) timed out, and this one > Did you get any reply, Bjorn? No, I never got a reply. Too bad.
+1 for C
+1 for A. I find it easier to read the title.
+! for C
+1 for B
+1 C, but I would lighten the "incubation" text some either by making the font less bold or making it a dark gray.
+1 for C, this is no contest.
(In reply to comment #65) > +1 C, but I would lighten the "incubation" text some either by making the font > less bold or making it a dark gray. You mean more like the Eclipse Ready logo? http://www.eclipse.org/artwork/eclipseready/images/rea_eclipse_pos_logo_fc_sm.jpg
Created attachment 65885 [details] Gray + non-bold fonts (In reply to comment #65) I'm not sure if I should be adding these to the list of candidates now, but here are Type C with gray text and lighter weight font.
(In reply to comment #68) > I'm not sure if I should be adding these to the list of candidates now, > but here are Type C with gray text and lighter weight font. +1 for C', the one on the left. The text is bold easy to read, but has a low enough contrast not take away from the purple section titles on a Phoenix-skinned project page.
+1 for C' on the left of the attachment in comment 68
(In reply to comment #68) +1 for c'.
+1 for c'.
11 votes submitted so far, with no new ones in the last 13 days. Design | Votes A 1 B 1 C 3 (was 5, but -2 votes changed from C -> C') C' 4 (was 2, but +2 votes changed from C -> C') Going once... going twice...
The instructions for incubation logos have been updated to refer to C'. Thanks for all your help! http://www.eclipse.org/projects/dev_process/incubation-conforming.php
